In reply to Greymist (msg # 10):

Thanks for sharing your approach! That certainly sounds like the easiest workaround to the current problem. Hopefully the mods will see my point that a clipboard would make this task SO much easier, plus it's easy to program, and I can't see a downside for the user.

In reply to 1492 (msg # 11):


I don't think it's a trick. I click quote on your post, and write this to you...

...then I scroll up and click quote on Greymist's post ...


...and then write what I want to him, all in the same thread. Not sure if it would work across threads (and I can't check on my phone), but it appears to work within one.

The issue here is that the clipboard exists at an OS level.  Windows, Mac, Linux, etc.  It's not within the site, without some crazy complicated javascript (which gets even more complicated to maintain and keep working) as you go.  At that point you're recreating something which already exists in the wild, which is a bit of a wasted effort (because you have to maintain / upkeep the code necessary for this function).

On the responsive site, the multi-quote functionality already exists (in a single thread -- I'll come to multi-threads in a minute).  You can see it yourself:

1. Open a blank reply to this thread.
   
2. Scroll up to any previous post, and click the "quote" button in the top right corner.  It will copy/paste/format the quoted text in your reply box.
   
3. Scroll up to another, different post, and click the "quote button there" -- the site will add the newly quoted message to the existing one in your reply box.
   
4. ...repeat as necessary.

This does NOT work across multiple threads -- the quote function (I'm guessing at this point) is limited to the current thread.

In reply to SunRuanEr (msg # 13):

Yes. I understand. The difficulty arises when dealing with multiple threads.

Most games I play have two basic active threads: (1) the game thread; and (2) an OOC thread. In that context, the quote function is rarely needed within the same thread, because the sequiturs from one player post to the next are usually clear. Where the quote function is essential, is when you want to take something from the game thread to the OOC thread in order to have a free-flowing discussion. This usually happens when a party decision has to be made, and the players need to work stuff out before returning to the game thread to continue on.

Skald says he quotes within the same thread 99% of the time. I would guess that I use quotes to reference something from a different thread, 99% of the time.

That would suggest that we represent the opposite ends of the bell curve, and the universe of users is likely somewhere in the middle. Ergo, perhaps something to consider addressing?

Again, assuming it's fairly easy to program, and would cause no discernible negative effect.

I'm no expert, but (respectfully) I don't see how this can be true. The main reason I have suggested this "clipboard" approach (and perhaps that is not even the right term), is that I am a member of another FREE forum, with the most minimal administrative budget, that has thousands of threads and uses a QUOTE button that operates in this fashion. So I know from experience on the two sites which one is far more user friendly.

Don't you worry about that - unless a change impacts upon site administration/policy, I'm just one vote like everyone else (alright, jase has power of veto, but he is dictator-for-life, so there has to be some perks that come with all that responsibility <grins>)

One caveat on the multiquoting - that's no longer available once you hit Preview, so the trick would be to quote all the bits and pieces you want first ... and type your responses too, cos Preview will certainly complain if it's all quote and no text.

The only real benefit you'd be getting from a new copy/multi-copy functionality would be the quote tags, otherwise you could do the same thing with Clipboard history as patchwolf (at least with Windows 10/11) - the problem is you might already have items in the clipboard, or add items twice by mistake ... putting the quoted text into tags in a new post as jase has done is a very elegant solution, as you can edit that, eg: select them in any order, move quotes around, delete them if you've changed your mind and don't want them any more or duplicated them or selected them by mistake - the new post in effect becomes a clipboard/scratchpad for you to organise 'em all first THEN finally copy them out into clipboard and paste them where you will, and you just have to close that once you're done (ie cancel post).

I'd much rather work with what I can see than what's held in computer memory.

BUT definitely like the suggestion to only quote selected text, not the whole post (unless nothing is selected, of course, which means you want the whole lot) - that'd certainly save a bit of deletion after the fact.  :>

If it helps, in the remaining 0.01 of the time where I do want to quote a post for offline discussion, I just hit quote and then select the relevant character(s) to convert it off to a Private Message - again, just a couple of clicks.

In reply to Skald (msg # 17):

Thanks for your time. I genuinely appreciate it.

I have clearly failed to articulate the problem, and the proposed solution, but it is after 2AM where I am, so I need some sleep. Perhaps another user will see this thread and can explain things better than I have. 'Night.

Many sites like that use established libraries of functions, which then get shared around the place like hotcakes.  It's one of the great things about open source code.

What we have here at rpol seems to be a custom-built site that does exactly what we want it to... and covers a lot of the gaps those other sites lack.  Multiple characters associated with one login?  Check.  Private lines inside main posts?  Check.  Secret lines which are private, but don't look like they're private?  I've never seen that anywhere else on the web.  Language functions that obfuscate the language being spoken for those who aren't included in the group -- and obfuscates in a way that a coordinated group couldn't decypher it?

The list goes on...

And now for the contribution of a player who still uses a desktop, when ever he can.

I often have a number of windows open with different RPoL posts and threads open -  being DM of a complicated game is fun.  However, I also have browser windows looking at other websites, PDF documents, word and (sometimes) Excel documents that I am referencing all in the same post!  I highlight and copy text in all of those apps, using the OS clipboard and using OS commands  - Ctrl-C and Ctrl-V in my case.  That OS copy/paste facility will be available through your phone, somehow, although you will have to make sure that you understand your OS functionality properly.

In the target post -  I rarely even bother with the 'quote' option on the menu -  but just key in the  quote tags.  If I am feeling pedantic -  and sometimes it is good to tell a rules-Lawyer player where you got your information from -  then I quote the source as well.   EG <quote source>Quoted Text</quote>



Using that technique, you can build a post full of quotes from as many different sources as you like :) ....  BUT NOW, a misused motivational quote from one of my great heroes ...

Too busy with responsive at the moment as well as recovering from Covid so won't contribute much to this except to say there's a huge difference between the current quoting system and being able to select and quote.

The current system:

• Includes formatting.
• Removes private information (e.g. Private lines, languages etc).

Selecting text and quoting will just give you a copy and paste.

Speaking of copy and paste, I'm not sure I'm inclined to go to a whole bunch of effort to remove the need for control-c.

Three votes for CTRL+C in a row (including mine).  Just shows we're proper old school - my wife just looks at me when I say "hit CTRL+C" to select text, then she right clicks and selects copy from the menu ...  <grrrins>

And for the record - from the thread number in the address bar, looks like 1492 has the honour of the 1000th.  That's a lot of suggestions !  :>

Eek, feel better you busy man!

Highlighted for emphasis, here - I hadn't thought about the fact that our current quoting keeps formatting and removes private lines, but a 'quote just the highlighted part' wouldn't. That alone is enough for me to change my vote solidly to 'The current quote function, especially now that we have in-line quoting, is perfectly fine as is, please ignore my previous +1 for highlighted quoting.'

Losing the formatting wouldn't necessarily be game-breaking, just a PITA, but losing the automatic hiding of private information COULD and probably WOULD be in more instances than it's useful.


It's like you live in my house, Skald, only I'm the one right-clicking over here! <.<

Honestly, I don't find it terribly difficult to highlight the part of a post that I want to keep, hit 'quote', and then highlight the entire quoted text, paste in the part I want, and continue on my merry way. Being able to auto-quote the highlighted part would skip the erase-and-paste step, BUT if the formatting got eaten, it would require me to re-format in order to have the quote look right, and that's potentially a LOT more work.

Mate, I know people who will still move the mouse allllllllll the way over to click on the "edit" menu then down to click on "copy".

Me, I try to avoid taking my hands off the keyboard wherever possible.  Half the damn time I just hard-code the tags to do everything here on rpol anyway.

In reply to patchwolf (msg # 25):

*grin*  I use all three techniques as, and when, I feel like it - sometimes I decide that one technique is more suitable, or convenient, to the task in hand.  Another time, I'll use a different technique.   It is the same with RPoL tags - sometimes I code them directly, sometimes I select text and select effects from the menu (especially when I want more than one effect)  at other times I just click the button, and just let it format whatever I key in ...

The more tools you know how to use, the easier life is  :)

oh man, I drive my boyfriend nuts with this, just because I don’t have space in my brain for all the keyboard shortcuts he’s tried to teach me.

(like the section symbol, I STILL can’t remember it no matter how many times he tells me, both for windows and Mac)

CTRL-C is fine if you just need the text but don’t need to show it as a quote from a particular player.

Also, none of the above ease of use functionality is needed for those GMs or players using a PC with several screens open and many open windows.

But, it would be extraordinarily helpful when trying to quote (one or more posts) from one thread to a completely different thread (usually “In Character” thread to “Out of Character” thread) when using a phone or mobile device.

Since the existing Quote function already strips out private messages/foreign language/etc, that text is not an issue when moving the text you want to quote to an in-system clipboard before pasting the quote into a different thread.

Again. Not an issue if I’m power-computing on my work or home desktop PC with multiple screens and multiple windows open. Just an issue when I’m trying to quote post across threads on my phone where switching back and forth between multiple app screens is a more cumbersome.

Not an issue for the Dec 2023 launch, but would be a nice feature to have in the future after the Responsive Site is up and running smoothly.

Throwing in my 2 copper pieces here... I would love to see the Quote function work with closed threads...  There are quite a few times that I have wanted to snip something from a closed/notice thread into a new thread with the text colors/etc. of the original poster but RPoL just ignores the Quote request because it can't pop open a new post on a closed thread...  The suggestion of making it a clipboard function does seem a little duplicative of the OS but RPoL should still allow the new post window with the quoted information (regardless of whether it is decided to allow quoting of individual segments or keeping the entire post)...  For closed threads, it should be a simple matter of greying out the "Post Message" button...

Or, possibly even providing a drop down for "Post In" with the open threads being shown there...
This message was last edited by the user at 03:24, Sun 03 Dec 2023.

That makes sense - after decades on a PC, I find it difficult to almost anything on a mobile phone !

A quick check with Google suggests that Google Gboard (Android only) and Microsoft Swiftkey (Android and iOS) have a clipboard feature ... might be worth looking at ?? (on the basis that if there is existing functionality available that'll do the job, we don't need to reinvent it).  :>

I'm not sure this is a problem even if you do need to show it from a particular player as you can easily use the quick formatting "quote" option and just edit the opening tag to include the player's name... I think the problem comes in when you need/want to keep the style/bold/italic/etc. tags of the original quote...

THAT captures one of the issues PERFECTLY!!!

If you can Quote, BUT NOT HAVE IT TRY TO FORCE THAT QUOTE ONTO THE CURRENT THREAD BUT LET YOU PUT IT (somewhere else), THAT WOULD SOLVE BOTH PROBLEMS!

Forcing a quote to go into its current thread is the limitation. If you could capture the quote from a closed or open thread and then drop it on a clipboard or different thread, BOTH problems solved!

In reply to Jack (msg # 28) and Lisa (msg # 29). Thank you for helping to explain.

In reply to Skald (msg # 30). Thanks to you as well. Makes me feel better to know you are actually giving the matter some thought.

To be clear, I was never asking for a button that would operate no differently than CTRL C does. That would be stupid and pointless. Such a suggestion is easily dismissed, because it's a straw man.

That said, I know you guys are super busy with the transition to the new site, so I am going to leave this alone for now and perhaps revisit the issue a few months down the road. I need to make another attempt to articulate what the problem is and how the solution would work. If/when I do that, I'm confident the site admins would be interested in reconsidering it.

Sure. If you want to go to the extra effort of inserting the format and then typing the original author, then the short cut I’m referring to is unnecessary b/c you are eliminating all shortcuts/macros.

And, yes, you lose all the original formatting too.

Being able to capture a quote, and then deciding where you want to paste it (other than just in a new post on the current thread) would be helpful if you aren’t sitting at a PC with multiple screens and windows open.

That said, NOT being able to easily quote from a closed thread might be deliberate.

It certainly lessens the possibilities of someone continuing a closed discussion, or in the case of something IC, quoting a scene that's no longer valid. Obviously, you can still DO that if you quote manually and enter all the formatting yourself, but it would definitely make it less likely to happen by accident (in the case of IC) or in a fit of pique (in the case of conversations that have been deliberately shut down).

In one of my games, we CONSTANTLY have to go back to a Closed thread to confirm an in-game date and time for historical events. The thread is closed to prevent any accidental new posts or to prevent edits to old posts, but it sure would be nice to be able to bring the quote from an earlier thread into the current thread.

As it works now, we just cite to the thread & msg # and then everyone has to go to the old, closed thread, search for the post, and then see what was posted.

I guess someone could have a nefarious reason for quoting from a closed thread, but that can apply to any post in an open or closed thread so not sure I understand why that would be a reason to prohibit.

I’m guessing when the quote function was originally created, it was assumed it would never be needed except to populate a new post in the current thread. THAT is what the system allows. All other uses of a quoted text are either prohibited (closed thread scenario) or require multiple steps of copying/cutting/pasting (needed to put the quote in a different thread).
This message was last edited by the user at 04:07, Sun 03 Dec 2023.