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16:28, 3rd May 2024 (GMT+0)

[OOC] New Chat (Old)

Posted by Game MasterFor group 0
Raven
PC, 184 posts
Dark Stranger
Fri 28 Aug 2020
at 01:23
  • msg #43

Re: [OOC] New Chat

Khorolf Skullsplitter:
"You cut the vines and it summons a battle? These are most excellent vines indeed! And what luck! I ALREADY have my sword out!"


Normally Khorolf is borderline obnoxious but this, this is just hilarious!

Look at that and I already have my sword out.

Classic.
Huorielara
PC, 2 posts
Fri 28 Aug 2020
at 06:09
  • msg #44

Re: [OOC] New Chat

Hello people!

I'm the new one here, and I'm looking forward to playing with you all!^^
Gerad Waelhlem
PC, 488 posts
Channeler Of Mysteries
Occult Dabbler
Fri 28 Aug 2020
at 06:19
  • msg #45

Re: [OOC] New Chat

And hello there. Hopefully you will not be eaten by squirrels before we arrive - although that would be a little nuts!
Huorielara
PC, 3 posts
Fri 28 Aug 2020
at 06:24
  • msg #46

Re: [OOC] New Chat

Hehe, I don't know... Don't think that'll happen, but who knows. Then again, would be quite a way to go out!

But nah, I have faith in you all.
This message was last edited by the player at 07:04, Fri 28 Aug 2020.
John D'Oh
PC, 335 posts
Chemist and Forgemaster
12/13 GP, 42/42 HP, 20 AC
Fri 28 Aug 2020
at 07:49
  • msg #47

Re: [OOC] New Chat

Vine deer? What Vine Deer? Was that one of the 'random animals held in the air by the sickly yellow vines'?
Game Master
GM, 2076 posts
Storyteller
Eclipse d20
Fri 28 Aug 2020
at 08:12
  • msg #48

Re: [OOC] New Chat

In reply to John D'Oh (msg # 47):

Yes, the creature Khorolf freed from the vines.
John D'Oh
PC, 337 posts
Chemist and Forgemaster
12/13 GP, 42/42 HP, 20 AC
Fri 28 Aug 2020
at 08:13
  • msg #49

Re: [OOC] New Chat

Ah. Not overly grateful then.....
Game Master
GM, 2079 posts
Storyteller
Eclipse d20
Fri 28 Aug 2020
at 09:06
  • msg #50

Re: [OOC] New Chat

Considering the vines are part of the creature...

<.<
>.>
Raven
PC, 185 posts
Dark Stranger
Fri 28 Aug 2020
at 12:49
  • msg #51

Re: [OOC] New Chat

How far away is vine deer? And are more of the creatures in the vines coming alive before we charge in and De-squirrialize the area.
Game Master
GM, 2080 posts
Storyteller
Eclipse d20
Fri 28 Aug 2020
at 15:25
  • msg #52

Re: [OOC] New Chat

In reply to Raven (msg # 51):

Seems to be only the one that Khorolf attacked showing any signs of movement.
Game Master
GM, 2081 posts
Storyteller
Eclipse d20
Fri 28 Aug 2020
at 16:30
  • msg #53

Re: [OOC] New Chat

John perhaps I missed something but what ability are you using that requires a standard action for a shield effect?
John D'Oh
PC, 339 posts
Chemist and Forgemaster
12/13 GP, 42/42 HP, 20 AC
Fri 28 Aug 2020
at 19:47
  • msg #54

Re: [OOC] New Chat

Innate Enchantment Shield Spell. I thought it was a Standard action, like an SLA.
Game Master
GM, 2082 posts
Storyteller
Eclipse d20
Fri 28 Aug 2020
at 20:33
  • msg #55

Re: [OOC] New Chat

No, it’s a constant always on.
John D'Oh
PC, 340 posts
Chemist and Forgemaster
12/13 GP, 42/42 HP, 20 AC
Fri 28 Aug 2020
at 20:57
  • msg #56

Re: [OOC] New Chat

Oh.

Can Light foot be used in a double-move leap for a truly anime attack?
Game Master
GM, 2083 posts
Storyteller
Eclipse d20
Fri 28 Aug 2020
at 21:24
  • msg #57

Re: [OOC] New Chat

If you are doing a double move then you get double your move.
John D'Oh
PC, 341 posts
Chemist and Forgemaster
12/13 GP, 42/42 HP, 20 AC
Fri 28 Aug 2020
at 21:27
  • msg #58

Re: [OOC] New Chat

Hmm, okay. Well I already posted a run and jump of 90'. That's cinematic enough and gets me in close.
John D'Oh
PC, 343 posts
Chemist and Forgemaster
12/13 GP, 42/42 HP, 20 AC
Mon 31 Aug 2020
at 04:29
  • msg #59

Re: [OOC] New Chat

I know that Fortune's Favor gives a Luck bonus to Skills and Ability checks. Does it affect anything else?
Game Master
GM, 2086 posts
Storyteller
Eclipse d20
Mon 31 Aug 2020
at 05:24
  • msg #60

Re: [OOC] New Chat

The Practical Enchanter, page 32:

quote:
Fortune’s Favor grants the recipient a (Spell Level +1) luck bonus on skill and attribute checks for its duration.


Looks to be isolated to skills and attribute checks.
Thalyssra Moonstrike
PC, 24 posts
Mon 31 Aug 2020
at 05:32
  • msg #61

Re: [OOC] New Chat

Just as an FYI, attribute checks apply to any sort of check that an ability score applies to that aren't otherwise specified(Attacks, saves, etc).

As I didn't know this until recently, this includes initiative checks.
This message was last edited by the player at 06:39, Mon 31 Aug 2020.
John D'Oh
PC, 344 posts
Chemist and Forgemaster
12/13 GP, 42/42 HP, 20 AC
Mon 31 Aug 2020
at 06:32
  • msg #62

Re: [OOC] New Chat

I knew about Initiative. Didn't know it applied to Saves. Thanks.
Thalyssra Moonstrike
PC, 25 posts
Mon 31 Aug 2020
at 06:40
  • msg #63

Re: [OOC] New Chat

In reply to John D'Oh (msg # 62):

I don't believe it does. Saves, attacks and similar specific stats are generally called out as such.
Gerad Waelhlem
PC, 491 posts
Channeler Of Mysteries
Occult Dabbler
Mon 31 Aug 2020
at 07:20
  • msg #64

Re: [OOC] New Chat

The Practical Enchanter specifically lists what kinds of bonuses apply to what. The only section listing "Initiative" is the Insight Bonus section. Since Initiative is specifically called out there, separately from "Checks", we know that spells from that book other than Insight Bonus spells do not affect Initiative. Similarly, Saving Throws are specifically called out as being separate from Checks.

The GM may rule otherwise, but that's the way that book is written, so that's how spells from it work.
  • Similarly, spells such as
  • Benediction specifically calls out Saves, Skill Checks, and Ability checks without mentioning initiative.
  • Crushing Despair (like Good Hope) specifies attack rolls, saving throws, ability checks, skill checks, and weapon damage rolls, but does not mention initiative.
  • Curse Of Ill Fortune calls out attack rolls, saving throws, ability checks, and skill checks without mentioning initiative.

Nerveskitter specifically calls out that it alters current initiatives. That establishes that spells cast after battle has begun generally do not alter initiatives.

Shock and Awe specifically penalizes initiative,  but nothing else.

Cat's Grace adds to Dexterity, and specifically calls out that it affects Initiative and other uses of the Dexterity Modifier.

Initiative checks specifically get their own definition in the rules - "At the start of a battle, each combatant makes an initiative check. An initiative check is a Dexterity check. Each character applies his or her Dexterity modifier to the roll. Characters act in order, counting down from highest result to lowest. In every round that follows, the characters act in the same order (unless a character takes an action that results in his or her initiative changing; see Special Initiative Actions)."

Now, that does classify them in the general category of Dexterity Checks, but then goes on to specify what applies to the roll - the characters dexterity modifier. That's consistent with the various spells. As usual in the System Reference Document, the specific - "Each character applies his or her Dexterity modifier to the roll" - normally overrides the general - "is a Dexterity Check".

And yes, I am well aware of the various arguments that say that check modifiers should apply (and, it appears, in fifth edition they do) - but that really doesn't seem to be the way that 3.5 was written.

On the practical side, given that allowing spells that modify checks will keep changing characters initiatives - thus needlessly complicating an already overly complicated combat system - I think it's a poor idea. It's still ultimately up to the game master though.
John D'Oh
PC, 345 posts
Chemist and Forgemaster
12/13 GP, 42/42 HP, 20 AC
Mon 31 Aug 2020
at 09:00
  • msg #65

Re: [OOC] New Chat

Every forum I've ever read for 3.5 agrees that Luckstones and other things that affect ability checks will as a result affect Initiative. Said Forums also agree that Saves are not Ability Checks.
Thalyssra Moonstrike
PC, 26 posts
Mon 31 Aug 2020
at 17:25
  • msg #66

Re: [OOC] New Chat

I know for a fact that the 3.5 Factotum's 'Brains over Brawn' ability lets you add you Int to your Dex for initiative.

It specifically says "You gain your Int bonus to Str checks, Dex checks, and checks involving skills with those stats."

This, while being 5e, also says Initiative is Dex check: https://dnd.wizards.com/articl...advice/ability-check

There are attack rolls, saves, and skill checks. Everything else is an ability check. Which would be a Str check where you add your Str to the roll, or a Cha check where you add you Cha. Such as your turning check.
Gerad Waelhlem
PC, 492 posts
Channeler Of Mysteries
Occult Dabbler
Tue 1 Sep 2020
at 01:54
  • msg #67

Re: [OOC] New Chat

And I've seen forum threads that concluded just the opposite. I've also seen some reaching quite interesting conclusions on biology and physics, along with some that concluded that the Earth is flat. An argument is only as good as the facts and logic that support it. That's why I quoted chunks of the rules.

Now, as far as the Factotum goes, as I have already pointed out, d20 is an exception based system. The fact that the Factotum has a specific special rule to allow it to do something is a class special ability - and does not apply elsewhere. That's why I quoted a selection of general use spells.

Now, if you want to talk about other editions, Fourth and Fifth edition are entirely irrelevant, given that they did not exist when 3.0 and 3.5 were written.

So lets check out First and Second edition. They at least existed at the time and - rather blatantly - had an influence on the general rules system. Since "Luckstones" were mentioned, I'll take a look at them.

quote:
Stone of Good Luck (Luckstone): This magical stone is typically a bit of rough polished agate or similar mineral. Its possessor gains a +1 (+5% where applicable) on all dice rolls involving factors such as saving, slipping, dodging, etc. — whenever a die or dice are rolled to find whether the character has an adverse happening befall or not. This luck does not affect “to hit” and damage dice or spell failure dice. Additionally, the luckstone gives the possessor a ±1%-10% (at owner’s option) on rolls for determination of magic items or division of treasure. The most favorable results will always be gained with a stone of good luck.


That was the same in both First and Second edition, and it covered saves yes, and certain kinds of attribute checks - but definitely not initiative. It also didn't cover skills of any kind, since skill systems were entirely optional in First and Second edition.

If you want to talk about the specific spell from The Practical Enchanter, nothing from any forum is likely to apply unless they're specifically talking about that product - and even then it would be mostly opinion. If you actually want an authoritative answer as to the spells in that book you could try asking the author. He hasn't posted for some time, but may still be answering questions.
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